Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 19:22:05 GMT -5
'Some' have only partially co-opted his positions in order to not bite the hand that feeds, and fake pump left.
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 19:23:32 GMT -5
spsp ESP
you could start a youtube channel
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 19:24:43 GMT -5
Just callin' 'em like I see 'em
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 19:27:54 GMT -5
what am I thinking right now
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 19:28:24 GMT -5
"cum shit fart ass cum"
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 19:29:10 GMT -5
no ME, not YOU
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 19:29:39 GMT -5
that's what the quotes are for
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 19:30:56 GMT -5
oh how interesting, you used apostrophes as quotes a few posts up
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 19:31:41 GMT -5
I'm a lazy typist what can I say
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killedbyboard
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Post by killedbyboard on Oct 26, 2019 19:32:23 GMT -5
The difficulty here is voter share. Bernie and liz are basically going after the same group, They really aren't though. Warren supporters are white, upper middle class college educated types. The professional managerial class. Bernie supporters are the working poor, lower class and far more ethnically diverse. His top donor profession is public school teacher and the top three employers of his donations are employees of walmart, amazon and starbucks. It's still not wrong that they are going after the same group. Liz is going after Bernie's progressive young person, lower middle to lower class voter. She needs that group.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 19:33:50 GMT -5
Anyway, Warren doesn't even mention single payer, and leaves mental health plans up to private insurance.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 19:34:23 GMT -5
I don't know guys. I like a guy with private sector experience. Tom Steyer is always coming on TV telling me he can win and has a bunch of money. I like em, you know?
Beto is nice but far too white.
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 19:39:18 GMT -5
Anyway, Warren doesn't even mention single payer, and leaves mental health plans up to private insurance. Honestly asking, not kidding around: isn't this like the poster issue where she and Bernie are identical policy-wise? Medicare currently covers mental health care (I am unsure of the specifics) and they both support Medicare For All as the top line of their healthcare policies.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 19:40:27 GMT -5
Her plan on her website never mentions a single-payer plan and leaves mental health up to insurance companies. She just wants to wrangle in prices and what not.
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 19:40:37 GMT -5
I don't know guys. I like a guy with private sector experience. Tom Steyer is always coming on TV telling me he can win and has a bunch of money. I like em, you know? Beto is nice but far too white. um excuse me Beto is a Latinx punk rock skateboarder
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 19:40:54 GMT -5
God forbid people get excited about someone who would actually try to improve their lives and acts like he gives a shit about the working class. That's not it. All I hear from Sanders supporters, nonstop, is how all they care about is someone who will make a material difference in people's lives by changing their living/working conditions, etc. etc. But whenever someone is asked what the substantive differences are that make them prefer Sanders over Warren, for example, the answer is *invariably* "BuT HeR SuPpOrTeRs ArE wHiTe" or "ShE wAs A rEpUbLiCaN" or something equally non-specific and non-substantive. The most annoying one to me is "He came up with all these policy ideas that the other candidates have now co-opted." Well, good thing it's not an originality contest then, it's a literal popularity contest. Who gives a flat-out fuck who comes up with an idea in the political sphere Why do Sanders supporters always have to explain their support for him over Warren and never the other way around? Constantly punching left. Constantly asked to compromise. You can use the caps/lowercase type all you want, but her supporters being mostly white and being a Republican during the Reagan era matter to a lot of people. And they should. Enough to question her motives and positions on issues that matter to the working class. I don't think the argument that he came up with these policy ideas is about originality. It's just pointing out the fact that he has been fighting for these things his entire career while everyone else waited until it was politically convenient. Again, this matters to a lot of people, as it should. One of the main reasons people support Bernie is because they actually believe that he won't back down or compromise given his record.
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 19:40:58 GMT -5
Her plan on her website never mentions a single-payer plan and leaves mental health up to insurance companies. She just wants to wrangle in prices and what not. Medicare is a single payer plan
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 19:41:26 GMT -5
That's not it. All I hear from Sanders supporters, nonstop, is how all they care about is someone who will make a material difference in people's lives by changing their living/working conditions, etc. etc. But whenever someone is asked what the substantive differences are that make them prefer Sanders over Warren, for example, the answer is *invariably* "BuT HeR SuPpOrTeRs ArE wHiTe" or "ShE wAs A rEpUbLiCaN" or something equally non-specific and non-substantive. The most annoying one to me is "He came up with all these policy ideas that the other candidates have now co-opted." Well, good thing it's not an originality contest then, it's a literal popularity contest. Who gives a flat-out fuck who comes up with an idea in the political sphere Why do Sanders supporters always have to explain their support for him over Warren and never the other way around? Constantly punching left. Constantly asked to compromise. You can use the caps/lowercase type all you want, but her supporters being mostly white and being a Republican during the Reagan era matter to a lot of people. And they should. Enough to question her motives and positions on issues that matter to the working class. I don't think the argument that he came up with these policy ideas is about originality. It's just pointing out the fact that he has been fighting for these things his entire career while everyone else waited until it was politically convenient. Again, this matters to a lot of people, as it should. One of the main reasons people support Bernie is because they actually believe that he won't back down or compromise given his record. ok, I like them both, but Bernie is way more likely to die before inauguration day decision made
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lobsterdog
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Post by lobsterdog on Oct 26, 2019 19:52:15 GMT -5
I like Bernie and would be happy to vote for him as I've said many times. But the cult of personality around him is p creepy 5+ defensive posts incoming i think its a large misunderstanding of whats going on to call it a cult of personality. i wish like hell someone else was running with his platform cuz hes old as shit and white and from a lilly white state but he's the only one with the right policy platform so...
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 20:03:37 GMT -5
Her plan on her website never mentions a single-payer plan and leaves mental health up to insurance companies. She just wants to wrangle in prices and what not. Medicare is a single payer plan Yes but we're aware of both candidates recent history. I don't see how it's so hard to understand that she just cannot be as easily trusted.
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 20:04:16 GMT -5
I like Bernie and would be happy to vote for him as I've said many times. But the cult of personality around him is p creepy 5+ defensive posts incoming i think its a large misunderstanding of whats going on to call it a cult of personality. i wish like hell someone else was running with his platform cuz hes old as shit and white and from a lilly white state but he's the only one with the right policy platform so... The reason I call it that is partly because of the "Bernie or nobody" attitude among his stupidest supporters, which are many. If they claim to care only about improving the material conditions of the working class, that it's all about outcomes and results and policy, then they should be the first ones committing to voting for whoever the Dem candidate is. But that is not what I see, anecdotally, either among my real-life circles or on this board. edit: and yes if Bernie was 70 and healthy and Liz was 78 with health problems, I honestly would likely prefer Bernie.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 20:05:32 GMT -5
I'm just kind of lost since Tim Ryan dropped out.
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 20:07:18 GMT -5
Medicare is a single payer plan Yes but we're aware of both candidates recent history. I don't see how it's so hard to understand that she just cannot be as easily trusted. How so? This is the problem I'm talking about. People will bloviate about how Bernie is the real working-class champion over Warren until the cows come home, but when you ask why they think that, they will say because of reasons, and they know that because of sources.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 20:13:14 GMT -5
I'm remembering her town hall from a few months ago, when asked about Medicare For All. Her answer suggested "Medicare For All" was mostly just a slogan to bargain to better access with the affordable care act. Where as Sanders has been talking about this for... who knows how long?
At that town hall, the moderator even brought up Sander's plan to essentially rid of private health insurance companies. And her answer was so wishy-washy.
Put that up with how many two faced Democrats there are, 99% of them... and I'm going to stick with the guy who doesn't change with the wind. Because what happens with these people is they say one thing to win an election and never even begin to negotiate from their campaigned position, so they're already compromised on gaining "material concessions."
And without Bernie's presence who knows what she would claim to support.
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lobsterdog
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Post by lobsterdog on Oct 26, 2019 20:13:43 GMT -5
Yes but we're aware of both candidates recent history. I don't see how it's so hard to understand that she just cannot be as easily trusted. How so? This is the problem I'm talking about. People will bloviate about how Bernie is the real working-class champion over Warren until the cows come home, but when you ask why they think that, they will say because of reasons, and they know that because of sources. i mean, do you listen to each of them talk? warren doesn't talk about class warfare. she talks about kind capitalism. she talks about leveling the playing field. bernie talks in way more pointed and class conscious language, and has for 4 decades. when someone tells you who they are, believe them.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 20:20:28 GMT -5
Nobody could say this about Sanders.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 20:21:28 GMT -5
Did Harry Reid just come back from a Death Threat show?
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 20:22:46 GMT -5
How so? This is the problem I'm talking about. People will bloviate about how Bernie is the real working-class champion over Warren until the cows come home, but when you ask why they think that, they will say because of reasons, and they know that because of sources. i mean, do you listen to each of them talk? warren doesn't talk about class warfare. she talks about kind capitalism. she talks about leveling the playing field. bernie talks in way more pointed and class conscious language, and has for 4 decades. when someone tells you who they are, believe them. You're still talking about soft qualitative differences and what specific word choices people made instead of actual policy differences, but ok I am also not a marxist so I don't particularly care what they say regarding class and capitalism, their policies are similar enough for me to want the one who will probably live through her first term
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2019 20:23:43 GMT -5
Bruh you don't care about the engine of history? Hmmmmm
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pbcookies
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Post by pbcookies on Oct 26, 2019 20:24:00 GMT -5
I'm asking for what you actually prefer about Bernie and you're giving me which one said "poor" more often in tweets
good grief
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